Does a kenku bard need an instrument, or can they use Mimicry for one?












14














I'd like to play a Kenku Bard in Adventurer's League, one raised by bards since a young age to hopefully become a master of the Bardic arts through copying many other skilled bards.



One thought that also came up though: Would he need an instument?



The PHB states about bard magic:




In the worlds of D&D, words and music are not just vibrations of air, but vocalizations with power all their own. The bard is a master of song, speech, and the magic they contain. Bards say that the multiverse was spoken into existence, that the words of the gods gave it shape, and that echoes of these primordial Words of Creation still resound throughout the cosmos. The music of bards is an attempt to snatch and harness those echoes, subtly woven into their spells and powers.




So, that would mean (in the words of my DM) that the musical instrument isn't a spell focus like a wizards staff, but rather an instrument to help recreate the perfect sound to touch the magical essence needed to create fire from thin air, or whatever magic you wanted.



If so, does that mean a Kenku could use Mimicry as their instrument, assuming they heard the right sounds from that specific instrument before?










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    Related on Does a bard have to play a musical instrument when using it as a spellcasting focus
    – NautArch
    Dec 18 at 14:52
















14














I'd like to play a Kenku Bard in Adventurer's League, one raised by bards since a young age to hopefully become a master of the Bardic arts through copying many other skilled bards.



One thought that also came up though: Would he need an instument?



The PHB states about bard magic:




In the worlds of D&D, words and music are not just vibrations of air, but vocalizations with power all their own. The bard is a master of song, speech, and the magic they contain. Bards say that the multiverse was spoken into existence, that the words of the gods gave it shape, and that echoes of these primordial Words of Creation still resound throughout the cosmos. The music of bards is an attempt to snatch and harness those echoes, subtly woven into their spells and powers.




So, that would mean (in the words of my DM) that the musical instrument isn't a spell focus like a wizards staff, but rather an instrument to help recreate the perfect sound to touch the magical essence needed to create fire from thin air, or whatever magic you wanted.



If so, does that mean a Kenku could use Mimicry as their instrument, assuming they heard the right sounds from that specific instrument before?










share|improve this question




















  • 1




    Related on Does a bard have to play a musical instrument when using it as a spellcasting focus
    – NautArch
    Dec 18 at 14:52














14












14








14







I'd like to play a Kenku Bard in Adventurer's League, one raised by bards since a young age to hopefully become a master of the Bardic arts through copying many other skilled bards.



One thought that also came up though: Would he need an instument?



The PHB states about bard magic:




In the worlds of D&D, words and music are not just vibrations of air, but vocalizations with power all their own. The bard is a master of song, speech, and the magic they contain. Bards say that the multiverse was spoken into existence, that the words of the gods gave it shape, and that echoes of these primordial Words of Creation still resound throughout the cosmos. The music of bards is an attempt to snatch and harness those echoes, subtly woven into their spells and powers.




So, that would mean (in the words of my DM) that the musical instrument isn't a spell focus like a wizards staff, but rather an instrument to help recreate the perfect sound to touch the magical essence needed to create fire from thin air, or whatever magic you wanted.



If so, does that mean a Kenku could use Mimicry as their instrument, assuming they heard the right sounds from that specific instrument before?










share|improve this question















I'd like to play a Kenku Bard in Adventurer's League, one raised by bards since a young age to hopefully become a master of the Bardic arts through copying many other skilled bards.



One thought that also came up though: Would he need an instument?



The PHB states about bard magic:




In the worlds of D&D, words and music are not just vibrations of air, but vocalizations with power all their own. The bard is a master of song, speech, and the magic they contain. Bards say that the multiverse was spoken into existence, that the words of the gods gave it shape, and that echoes of these primordial Words of Creation still resound throughout the cosmos. The music of bards is an attempt to snatch and harness those echoes, subtly woven into their spells and powers.




So, that would mean (in the words of my DM) that the musical instrument isn't a spell focus like a wizards staff, but rather an instrument to help recreate the perfect sound to touch the magical essence needed to create fire from thin air, or whatever magic you wanted.



If so, does that mean a Kenku could use Mimicry as their instrument, assuming they heard the right sounds from that specific instrument before?







dnd-5e bard dnd-adventurers-league






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edited Dec 18 at 19:21









V2Blast

19.7k356121




19.7k356121










asked Dec 18 at 12:51









Honore Shadeshield

375110




375110








  • 1




    Related on Does a bard have to play a musical instrument when using it as a spellcasting focus
    – NautArch
    Dec 18 at 14:52














  • 1




    Related on Does a bard have to play a musical instrument when using it as a spellcasting focus
    – NautArch
    Dec 18 at 14:52








1




1




Related on Does a bard have to play a musical instrument when using it as a spellcasting focus
– NautArch
Dec 18 at 14:52




Related on Does a bard have to play a musical instrument when using it as a spellcasting focus
– NautArch
Dec 18 at 14:52










2 Answers
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31














Your DM does not get to make determinations like this in Adventurers League play.



The rules are quite clear on spell components. As far as material components goes:




Casting some spells requires particular objects, specified in parentheses in the component entry. A character can use a component pouch or a spellcasting focus (found in “Equipment”) in place of the components specified for a spell. But if a cost is indicated for a component, a character must have that specific component before he or she can cast the spell.




In other words, you either need the appropriate material component or a focus item. For bard spellcasting, that focus item can be a musical instrument.




You can use a musical instrument (see the Tools section) as a spellcasting focus for your bard spells.




Wizard class features have a very similar passage:




You can use an arcane focus (see the Adventuring Gear section) as a spellcasting focus for your wizard spells.




Based on the published rules, to which DDAL cleaves very closely, your DM's personal interpretation is flat out wrong: other than what physical object they are allowed to be, a bard's spellcasting focus and a wizard's spellcasting focus function in exactly the same manner. In fact, there isn't even anything saying a bard must play the instrument to use it as a focus - they just need to have it in-hand.



As for using Mimicry... a kenku's voice is not a musical instrument. Verbal components are a different category of spell component. While there are rules for using a focus-bearing-hand to complete somatic components, it still requires the character to have the focus object.






share|improve this answer































    12














    No Bard needs an instrument



    Any Bard can cast spells that don't require material components without having access to any instrument at all, assuming they can provide any verbal or somatic components required by the spells. The instrument isn't strictly needed for material components either, since it can be replaced by a component pouch. Even if a Bard chooses to use an instrument, they only need to access it --- playing the instrument for magic is not required (it'd quite disproportionately favor any one-handed instruments!).



    Your GM's statement is unclear on whether they're intending to change the above. Ruling that the Bard needs no focus to perform material components because of their mimicry will have a balance impact, particularly for Valor Bards who have good aptitudes for swords and shields. It'd effectively allow them to also use material components without freeing up a hand, which is a significant boon. I would recommend against houseruling this unless you, as a group, are comfortable with potentially altering the balance of the game.






    share|improve this answer





















    • I'm visualizing a shield that functions as a tambourine. Who says it has to be a weapon?
      – Jammin4CO
      Dec 18 at 22:10










    • @Jammin4CO Then you'd need to have the other hand free to strike it, I guess.
      – Federico Poloni
      Dec 19 at 8:17











    Your Answer





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    2 Answers
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    2 Answers
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    31














    Your DM does not get to make determinations like this in Adventurers League play.



    The rules are quite clear on spell components. As far as material components goes:




    Casting some spells requires particular objects, specified in parentheses in the component entry. A character can use a component pouch or a spellcasting focus (found in “Equipment”) in place of the components specified for a spell. But if a cost is indicated for a component, a character must have that specific component before he or she can cast the spell.




    In other words, you either need the appropriate material component or a focus item. For bard spellcasting, that focus item can be a musical instrument.




    You can use a musical instrument (see the Tools section) as a spellcasting focus for your bard spells.




    Wizard class features have a very similar passage:




    You can use an arcane focus (see the Adventuring Gear section) as a spellcasting focus for your wizard spells.




    Based on the published rules, to which DDAL cleaves very closely, your DM's personal interpretation is flat out wrong: other than what physical object they are allowed to be, a bard's spellcasting focus and a wizard's spellcasting focus function in exactly the same manner. In fact, there isn't even anything saying a bard must play the instrument to use it as a focus - they just need to have it in-hand.



    As for using Mimicry... a kenku's voice is not a musical instrument. Verbal components are a different category of spell component. While there are rules for using a focus-bearing-hand to complete somatic components, it still requires the character to have the focus object.






    share|improve this answer




























      31














      Your DM does not get to make determinations like this in Adventurers League play.



      The rules are quite clear on spell components. As far as material components goes:




      Casting some spells requires particular objects, specified in parentheses in the component entry. A character can use a component pouch or a spellcasting focus (found in “Equipment”) in place of the components specified for a spell. But if a cost is indicated for a component, a character must have that specific component before he or she can cast the spell.




      In other words, you either need the appropriate material component or a focus item. For bard spellcasting, that focus item can be a musical instrument.




      You can use a musical instrument (see the Tools section) as a spellcasting focus for your bard spells.




      Wizard class features have a very similar passage:




      You can use an arcane focus (see the Adventuring Gear section) as a spellcasting focus for your wizard spells.




      Based on the published rules, to which DDAL cleaves very closely, your DM's personal interpretation is flat out wrong: other than what physical object they are allowed to be, a bard's spellcasting focus and a wizard's spellcasting focus function in exactly the same manner. In fact, there isn't even anything saying a bard must play the instrument to use it as a focus - they just need to have it in-hand.



      As for using Mimicry... a kenku's voice is not a musical instrument. Verbal components are a different category of spell component. While there are rules for using a focus-bearing-hand to complete somatic components, it still requires the character to have the focus object.






      share|improve this answer


























        31












        31








        31






        Your DM does not get to make determinations like this in Adventurers League play.



        The rules are quite clear on spell components. As far as material components goes:




        Casting some spells requires particular objects, specified in parentheses in the component entry. A character can use a component pouch or a spellcasting focus (found in “Equipment”) in place of the components specified for a spell. But if a cost is indicated for a component, a character must have that specific component before he or she can cast the spell.




        In other words, you either need the appropriate material component or a focus item. For bard spellcasting, that focus item can be a musical instrument.




        You can use a musical instrument (see the Tools section) as a spellcasting focus for your bard spells.




        Wizard class features have a very similar passage:




        You can use an arcane focus (see the Adventuring Gear section) as a spellcasting focus for your wizard spells.




        Based on the published rules, to which DDAL cleaves very closely, your DM's personal interpretation is flat out wrong: other than what physical object they are allowed to be, a bard's spellcasting focus and a wizard's spellcasting focus function in exactly the same manner. In fact, there isn't even anything saying a bard must play the instrument to use it as a focus - they just need to have it in-hand.



        As for using Mimicry... a kenku's voice is not a musical instrument. Verbal components are a different category of spell component. While there are rules for using a focus-bearing-hand to complete somatic components, it still requires the character to have the focus object.






        share|improve this answer














        Your DM does not get to make determinations like this in Adventurers League play.



        The rules are quite clear on spell components. As far as material components goes:




        Casting some spells requires particular objects, specified in parentheses in the component entry. A character can use a component pouch or a spellcasting focus (found in “Equipment”) in place of the components specified for a spell. But if a cost is indicated for a component, a character must have that specific component before he or she can cast the spell.




        In other words, you either need the appropriate material component or a focus item. For bard spellcasting, that focus item can be a musical instrument.




        You can use a musical instrument (see the Tools section) as a spellcasting focus for your bard spells.




        Wizard class features have a very similar passage:




        You can use an arcane focus (see the Adventuring Gear section) as a spellcasting focus for your wizard spells.




        Based on the published rules, to which DDAL cleaves very closely, your DM's personal interpretation is flat out wrong: other than what physical object they are allowed to be, a bard's spellcasting focus and a wizard's spellcasting focus function in exactly the same manner. In fact, there isn't even anything saying a bard must play the instrument to use it as a focus - they just need to have it in-hand.



        As for using Mimicry... a kenku's voice is not a musical instrument. Verbal components are a different category of spell component. While there are rules for using a focus-bearing-hand to complete somatic components, it still requires the character to have the focus object.







        share|improve this answer














        share|improve this answer



        share|improve this answer








        edited Dec 18 at 16:18









        Slagmoth

        17.4k15095




        17.4k15095










        answered Dec 18 at 14:34









        T.J.L.

        29.2k5101154




        29.2k5101154

























            12














            No Bard needs an instrument



            Any Bard can cast spells that don't require material components without having access to any instrument at all, assuming they can provide any verbal or somatic components required by the spells. The instrument isn't strictly needed for material components either, since it can be replaced by a component pouch. Even if a Bard chooses to use an instrument, they only need to access it --- playing the instrument for magic is not required (it'd quite disproportionately favor any one-handed instruments!).



            Your GM's statement is unclear on whether they're intending to change the above. Ruling that the Bard needs no focus to perform material components because of their mimicry will have a balance impact, particularly for Valor Bards who have good aptitudes for swords and shields. It'd effectively allow them to also use material components without freeing up a hand, which is a significant boon. I would recommend against houseruling this unless you, as a group, are comfortable with potentially altering the balance of the game.






            share|improve this answer





















            • I'm visualizing a shield that functions as a tambourine. Who says it has to be a weapon?
              – Jammin4CO
              Dec 18 at 22:10










            • @Jammin4CO Then you'd need to have the other hand free to strike it, I guess.
              – Federico Poloni
              Dec 19 at 8:17
















            12














            No Bard needs an instrument



            Any Bard can cast spells that don't require material components without having access to any instrument at all, assuming they can provide any verbal or somatic components required by the spells. The instrument isn't strictly needed for material components either, since it can be replaced by a component pouch. Even if a Bard chooses to use an instrument, they only need to access it --- playing the instrument for magic is not required (it'd quite disproportionately favor any one-handed instruments!).



            Your GM's statement is unclear on whether they're intending to change the above. Ruling that the Bard needs no focus to perform material components because of their mimicry will have a balance impact, particularly for Valor Bards who have good aptitudes for swords and shields. It'd effectively allow them to also use material components without freeing up a hand, which is a significant boon. I would recommend against houseruling this unless you, as a group, are comfortable with potentially altering the balance of the game.






            share|improve this answer





















            • I'm visualizing a shield that functions as a tambourine. Who says it has to be a weapon?
              – Jammin4CO
              Dec 18 at 22:10










            • @Jammin4CO Then you'd need to have the other hand free to strike it, I guess.
              – Federico Poloni
              Dec 19 at 8:17














            12












            12








            12






            No Bard needs an instrument



            Any Bard can cast spells that don't require material components without having access to any instrument at all, assuming they can provide any verbal or somatic components required by the spells. The instrument isn't strictly needed for material components either, since it can be replaced by a component pouch. Even if a Bard chooses to use an instrument, they only need to access it --- playing the instrument for magic is not required (it'd quite disproportionately favor any one-handed instruments!).



            Your GM's statement is unclear on whether they're intending to change the above. Ruling that the Bard needs no focus to perform material components because of their mimicry will have a balance impact, particularly for Valor Bards who have good aptitudes for swords and shields. It'd effectively allow them to also use material components without freeing up a hand, which is a significant boon. I would recommend against houseruling this unless you, as a group, are comfortable with potentially altering the balance of the game.






            share|improve this answer












            No Bard needs an instrument



            Any Bard can cast spells that don't require material components without having access to any instrument at all, assuming they can provide any verbal or somatic components required by the spells. The instrument isn't strictly needed for material components either, since it can be replaced by a component pouch. Even if a Bard chooses to use an instrument, they only need to access it --- playing the instrument for magic is not required (it'd quite disproportionately favor any one-handed instruments!).



            Your GM's statement is unclear on whether they're intending to change the above. Ruling that the Bard needs no focus to perform material components because of their mimicry will have a balance impact, particularly for Valor Bards who have good aptitudes for swords and shields. It'd effectively allow them to also use material components without freeing up a hand, which is a significant boon. I would recommend against houseruling this unless you, as a group, are comfortable with potentially altering the balance of the game.







            share|improve this answer












            share|improve this answer



            share|improve this answer










            answered Dec 18 at 13:30









            kviiri

            33.7k7129195




            33.7k7129195












            • I'm visualizing a shield that functions as a tambourine. Who says it has to be a weapon?
              – Jammin4CO
              Dec 18 at 22:10










            • @Jammin4CO Then you'd need to have the other hand free to strike it, I guess.
              – Federico Poloni
              Dec 19 at 8:17


















            • I'm visualizing a shield that functions as a tambourine. Who says it has to be a weapon?
              – Jammin4CO
              Dec 18 at 22:10










            • @Jammin4CO Then you'd need to have the other hand free to strike it, I guess.
              – Federico Poloni
              Dec 19 at 8:17
















            I'm visualizing a shield that functions as a tambourine. Who says it has to be a weapon?
            – Jammin4CO
            Dec 18 at 22:10




            I'm visualizing a shield that functions as a tambourine. Who says it has to be a weapon?
            – Jammin4CO
            Dec 18 at 22:10












            @Jammin4CO Then you'd need to have the other hand free to strike it, I guess.
            – Federico Poloni
            Dec 19 at 8:17




            @Jammin4CO Then you'd need to have the other hand free to strike it, I guess.
            – Federico Poloni
            Dec 19 at 8:17


















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