Wouldn't Matt Smith be the 12th Doctor and not the 11th because David Tennant is both 10 and 11?












10














How is Matt Smith not the 12th Doctor (since David Tennant regenerated first into himself and then into Matt Smith)? Then wouldn't Peter Capaldi be the 13th Doctor? (Because that regeneration was a gift from the Time Lords thanks to Clara.)










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  • 4




    And it's more complicated than that, due to the existence of the Valeyard.
    – Spencer
    yesterday






  • 2




    And the War Doctor. :p
    – Longspeak
    16 hours ago










  • What about the war doctor played by John hurt? If you count his regeneration he should be 9th doctor, which screws up all numbers.
    – David S Podd
    3 hours ago
















10














How is Matt Smith not the 12th Doctor (since David Tennant regenerated first into himself and then into Matt Smith)? Then wouldn't Peter Capaldi be the 13th Doctor? (Because that regeneration was a gift from the Time Lords thanks to Clara.)










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  • 4




    And it's more complicated than that, due to the existence of the Valeyard.
    – Spencer
    yesterday






  • 2




    And the War Doctor. :p
    – Longspeak
    16 hours ago










  • What about the war doctor played by John hurt? If you count his regeneration he should be 9th doctor, which screws up all numbers.
    – David S Podd
    3 hours ago














10












10








10







How is Matt Smith not the 12th Doctor (since David Tennant regenerated first into himself and then into Matt Smith)? Then wouldn't Peter Capaldi be the 13th Doctor? (Because that regeneration was a gift from the Time Lords thanks to Clara.)










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How is Matt Smith not the 12th Doctor (since David Tennant regenerated first into himself and then into Matt Smith)? Then wouldn't Peter Capaldi be the 13th Doctor? (Because that regeneration was a gift from the Time Lords thanks to Clara.)







doctor-who regeneration






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edited 1 hour ago









Stormblessed

41418




41418






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asked yesterday









smelborp

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  • 4




    And it's more complicated than that, due to the existence of the Valeyard.
    – Spencer
    yesterday






  • 2




    And the War Doctor. :p
    – Longspeak
    16 hours ago










  • What about the war doctor played by John hurt? If you count his regeneration he should be 9th doctor, which screws up all numbers.
    – David S Podd
    3 hours ago














  • 4




    And it's more complicated than that, due to the existence of the Valeyard.
    – Spencer
    yesterday






  • 2




    And the War Doctor. :p
    – Longspeak
    16 hours ago










  • What about the war doctor played by John hurt? If you count his regeneration he should be 9th doctor, which screws up all numbers.
    – David S Podd
    3 hours ago








4




4




And it's more complicated than that, due to the existence of the Valeyard.
– Spencer
yesterday




And it's more complicated than that, due to the existence of the Valeyard.
– Spencer
yesterday




2




2




And the War Doctor. :p
– Longspeak
16 hours ago




And the War Doctor. :p
– Longspeak
16 hours ago












What about the war doctor played by John hurt? If you count his regeneration he should be 9th doctor, which screws up all numbers.
– David S Podd
3 hours ago




What about the war doctor played by John hurt? If you count his regeneration he should be 9th doctor, which screws up all numbers.
– David S Podd
3 hours ago










5 Answers
5






active

oldest

votes


















13














Here's the "regeneration" you're referring to:








The key here is that, while the Doctor did use up one of his regenerations, he didn't actually regenerate. He used just enough of the regeneration energy to heal himself, then channelled the rest into his severed hand from "The Christmas Invasion", preventing himself from fully changing.



You can think of it like the scene in "Let's Kill Hitler" where River Song transfers the last of her regeneration energy into the Doctor to revive him: on both occasions, the energy brought him back to life, but he didn't regenerate. So he's still the Tenth Doctor.






share|improve this answer





























    9














    It's complicated, more complicated than anyone knows exactly and this is why:



    In the episode "The Brain of Morbeus" The Doctor faced a Timelord, a criminal mastermind who had survived execution called Morbeus. In a desperate attempt to thwart his plans, The Doctor goaded Morbeus into a mental duel.



    They were both hooked to a machine which pitted all their mental resources from each of their many lives against the other's, their will and their knowledge and their determination to win, and to live.



    The effort killed The Doctor, and reduced his enemy Morbeus to an insane gibbering wreck who threw himself off a cliff, so The Doctor - even in death won.



    Whilst he was hooked up to the machine, The Doctor's and Morbeus's previous personas were displayed one by one as they were drawn into the contest - these images appeared among others:



    enter image description here
    Attribution: Peter 2018



    None of the (lower row of) above images are of Doctors that we can pinpoint and name easily, they all appeared before the image of William Hartnell, Peter Cushing (had you forgotten him too? Here.) Michael Jayston (as per comments), David Bradley (Here) et al..



    The Party line is that Peter Capaldi is the twelfth, but there's more to it, much more to it, perhaps more than even The Doctor himself knows - Rasillon knows, I don't.






    share|improve this answer










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    • 1




      Canonically, I'd expect that they're meant to be future versions considering that they're in a different colour with a sort of portally effect.
      – wizzwizz4
      22 hours ago










    • @wizzwizz4 Possibly, but their costumes appear to be from Earth's past - admittedly that's no guarantee of anything.
      – Duckisaduckisaduck
      15 hours ago





















    4














    Personally, I also thought that by regenerating into the "same" body, that ought to count as two separate Doctors. However, regardless of in-universe status, the numbering of the Doctors is really based on the out-of-universe actors who played the character. On that basis, since the actor did not change, the numbering of the Doctor did not change either.






    share|improve this answer





















    • Given the fuss Ten made about changing into a new body at the end (you know, about dying and a new man walking away with his memories) and how easily this went over, I conclude he didn't really regenerate here.
      – Mr Lister
      11 hours ago



















    4














    The numbers generally refer to the number of times the Doctor has regenerated, distinct from the number of times the Doctor has consumed one of his available regenrations.



    In short, new face, new actor, new number.






    share|improve this answer





























      2














      Canonically, there only is, was, and will ever be one Doctor. The numbering is simply a referencing device for commentating on the show.






      share|improve this answer








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        Your Answer








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        5 Answers
        5






        active

        oldest

        votes








        5 Answers
        5






        active

        oldest

        votes









        active

        oldest

        votes






        active

        oldest

        votes









        13














        Here's the "regeneration" you're referring to:








        The key here is that, while the Doctor did use up one of his regenerations, he didn't actually regenerate. He used just enough of the regeneration energy to heal himself, then channelled the rest into his severed hand from "The Christmas Invasion", preventing himself from fully changing.



        You can think of it like the scene in "Let's Kill Hitler" where River Song transfers the last of her regeneration energy into the Doctor to revive him: on both occasions, the energy brought him back to life, but he didn't regenerate. So he's still the Tenth Doctor.






        share|improve this answer


























          13














          Here's the "regeneration" you're referring to:








          The key here is that, while the Doctor did use up one of his regenerations, he didn't actually regenerate. He used just enough of the regeneration energy to heal himself, then channelled the rest into his severed hand from "The Christmas Invasion", preventing himself from fully changing.



          You can think of it like the scene in "Let's Kill Hitler" where River Song transfers the last of her regeneration energy into the Doctor to revive him: on both occasions, the energy brought him back to life, but he didn't regenerate. So he's still the Tenth Doctor.






          share|improve this answer
























            13












            13








            13






            Here's the "regeneration" you're referring to:








            The key here is that, while the Doctor did use up one of his regenerations, he didn't actually regenerate. He used just enough of the regeneration energy to heal himself, then channelled the rest into his severed hand from "The Christmas Invasion", preventing himself from fully changing.



            You can think of it like the scene in "Let's Kill Hitler" where River Song transfers the last of her regeneration energy into the Doctor to revive him: on both occasions, the energy brought him back to life, but he didn't regenerate. So he's still the Tenth Doctor.






            share|improve this answer












            Here's the "regeneration" you're referring to:








            The key here is that, while the Doctor did use up one of his regenerations, he didn't actually regenerate. He used just enough of the regeneration energy to heal himself, then channelled the rest into his severed hand from "The Christmas Invasion", preventing himself from fully changing.



            You can think of it like the scene in "Let's Kill Hitler" where River Song transfers the last of her regeneration energy into the Doctor to revive him: on both occasions, the energy brought him back to life, but he didn't regenerate. So he's still the Tenth Doctor.















            share|improve this answer












            share|improve this answer



            share|improve this answer










            answered yesterday









            F1Krazy

            4,3261740




            4,3261740

























                9














                It's complicated, more complicated than anyone knows exactly and this is why:



                In the episode "The Brain of Morbeus" The Doctor faced a Timelord, a criminal mastermind who had survived execution called Morbeus. In a desperate attempt to thwart his plans, The Doctor goaded Morbeus into a mental duel.



                They were both hooked to a machine which pitted all their mental resources from each of their many lives against the other's, their will and their knowledge and their determination to win, and to live.



                The effort killed The Doctor, and reduced his enemy Morbeus to an insane gibbering wreck who threw himself off a cliff, so The Doctor - even in death won.



                Whilst he was hooked up to the machine, The Doctor's and Morbeus's previous personas were displayed one by one as they were drawn into the contest - these images appeared among others:



                enter image description here
                Attribution: Peter 2018



                None of the (lower row of) above images are of Doctors that we can pinpoint and name easily, they all appeared before the image of William Hartnell, Peter Cushing (had you forgotten him too? Here.) Michael Jayston (as per comments), David Bradley (Here) et al..



                The Party line is that Peter Capaldi is the twelfth, but there's more to it, much more to it, perhaps more than even The Doctor himself knows - Rasillon knows, I don't.






                share|improve this answer










                New contributor




                Duckisaduckisaduck is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                Check out our Code of Conduct.














                • 1




                  Canonically, I'd expect that they're meant to be future versions considering that they're in a different colour with a sort of portally effect.
                  – wizzwizz4
                  22 hours ago










                • @wizzwizz4 Possibly, but their costumes appear to be from Earth's past - admittedly that's no guarantee of anything.
                  – Duckisaduckisaduck
                  15 hours ago


















                9














                It's complicated, more complicated than anyone knows exactly and this is why:



                In the episode "The Brain of Morbeus" The Doctor faced a Timelord, a criminal mastermind who had survived execution called Morbeus. In a desperate attempt to thwart his plans, The Doctor goaded Morbeus into a mental duel.



                They were both hooked to a machine which pitted all their mental resources from each of their many lives against the other's, their will and their knowledge and their determination to win, and to live.



                The effort killed The Doctor, and reduced his enemy Morbeus to an insane gibbering wreck who threw himself off a cliff, so The Doctor - even in death won.



                Whilst he was hooked up to the machine, The Doctor's and Morbeus's previous personas were displayed one by one as they were drawn into the contest - these images appeared among others:



                enter image description here
                Attribution: Peter 2018



                None of the (lower row of) above images are of Doctors that we can pinpoint and name easily, they all appeared before the image of William Hartnell, Peter Cushing (had you forgotten him too? Here.) Michael Jayston (as per comments), David Bradley (Here) et al..



                The Party line is that Peter Capaldi is the twelfth, but there's more to it, much more to it, perhaps more than even The Doctor himself knows - Rasillon knows, I don't.






                share|improve this answer










                New contributor




                Duckisaduckisaduck is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                Check out our Code of Conduct.














                • 1




                  Canonically, I'd expect that they're meant to be future versions considering that they're in a different colour with a sort of portally effect.
                  – wizzwizz4
                  22 hours ago










                • @wizzwizz4 Possibly, but their costumes appear to be from Earth's past - admittedly that's no guarantee of anything.
                  – Duckisaduckisaduck
                  15 hours ago
















                9












                9








                9






                It's complicated, more complicated than anyone knows exactly and this is why:



                In the episode "The Brain of Morbeus" The Doctor faced a Timelord, a criminal mastermind who had survived execution called Morbeus. In a desperate attempt to thwart his plans, The Doctor goaded Morbeus into a mental duel.



                They were both hooked to a machine which pitted all their mental resources from each of their many lives against the other's, their will and their knowledge and their determination to win, and to live.



                The effort killed The Doctor, and reduced his enemy Morbeus to an insane gibbering wreck who threw himself off a cliff, so The Doctor - even in death won.



                Whilst he was hooked up to the machine, The Doctor's and Morbeus's previous personas were displayed one by one as they were drawn into the contest - these images appeared among others:



                enter image description here
                Attribution: Peter 2018



                None of the (lower row of) above images are of Doctors that we can pinpoint and name easily, they all appeared before the image of William Hartnell, Peter Cushing (had you forgotten him too? Here.) Michael Jayston (as per comments), David Bradley (Here) et al..



                The Party line is that Peter Capaldi is the twelfth, but there's more to it, much more to it, perhaps more than even The Doctor himself knows - Rasillon knows, I don't.






                share|improve this answer










                New contributor




                Duckisaduckisaduck is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                Check out our Code of Conduct.









                It's complicated, more complicated than anyone knows exactly and this is why:



                In the episode "The Brain of Morbeus" The Doctor faced a Timelord, a criminal mastermind who had survived execution called Morbeus. In a desperate attempt to thwart his plans, The Doctor goaded Morbeus into a mental duel.



                They were both hooked to a machine which pitted all their mental resources from each of their many lives against the other's, their will and their knowledge and their determination to win, and to live.



                The effort killed The Doctor, and reduced his enemy Morbeus to an insane gibbering wreck who threw himself off a cliff, so The Doctor - even in death won.



                Whilst he was hooked up to the machine, The Doctor's and Morbeus's previous personas were displayed one by one as they were drawn into the contest - these images appeared among others:



                enter image description here
                Attribution: Peter 2018



                None of the (lower row of) above images are of Doctors that we can pinpoint and name easily, they all appeared before the image of William Hartnell, Peter Cushing (had you forgotten him too? Here.) Michael Jayston (as per comments), David Bradley (Here) et al..



                The Party line is that Peter Capaldi is the twelfth, but there's more to it, much more to it, perhaps more than even The Doctor himself knows - Rasillon knows, I don't.







                share|improve this answer










                New contributor




                Duckisaduckisaduck is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
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                share|improve this answer



                share|improve this answer








                edited 15 hours ago





















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                answered yesterday









                Duckisaduckisaduck

                1916




                1916




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                • 1




                  Canonically, I'd expect that they're meant to be future versions considering that they're in a different colour with a sort of portally effect.
                  – wizzwizz4
                  22 hours ago










                • @wizzwizz4 Possibly, but their costumes appear to be from Earth's past - admittedly that's no guarantee of anything.
                  – Duckisaduckisaduck
                  15 hours ago
















                • 1




                  Canonically, I'd expect that they're meant to be future versions considering that they're in a different colour with a sort of portally effect.
                  – wizzwizz4
                  22 hours ago










                • @wizzwizz4 Possibly, but their costumes appear to be from Earth's past - admittedly that's no guarantee of anything.
                  – Duckisaduckisaduck
                  15 hours ago










                1




                1




                Canonically, I'd expect that they're meant to be future versions considering that they're in a different colour with a sort of portally effect.
                – wizzwizz4
                22 hours ago




                Canonically, I'd expect that they're meant to be future versions considering that they're in a different colour with a sort of portally effect.
                – wizzwizz4
                22 hours ago












                @wizzwizz4 Possibly, but their costumes appear to be from Earth's past - admittedly that's no guarantee of anything.
                – Duckisaduckisaduck
                15 hours ago






                @wizzwizz4 Possibly, but their costumes appear to be from Earth's past - admittedly that's no guarantee of anything.
                – Duckisaduckisaduck
                15 hours ago













                4














                Personally, I also thought that by regenerating into the "same" body, that ought to count as two separate Doctors. However, regardless of in-universe status, the numbering of the Doctors is really based on the out-of-universe actors who played the character. On that basis, since the actor did not change, the numbering of the Doctor did not change either.






                share|improve this answer





















                • Given the fuss Ten made about changing into a new body at the end (you know, about dying and a new man walking away with his memories) and how easily this went over, I conclude he didn't really regenerate here.
                  – Mr Lister
                  11 hours ago
















                4














                Personally, I also thought that by regenerating into the "same" body, that ought to count as two separate Doctors. However, regardless of in-universe status, the numbering of the Doctors is really based on the out-of-universe actors who played the character. On that basis, since the actor did not change, the numbering of the Doctor did not change either.






                share|improve this answer





















                • Given the fuss Ten made about changing into a new body at the end (you know, about dying and a new man walking away with his memories) and how easily this went over, I conclude he didn't really regenerate here.
                  – Mr Lister
                  11 hours ago














                4












                4








                4






                Personally, I also thought that by regenerating into the "same" body, that ought to count as two separate Doctors. However, regardless of in-universe status, the numbering of the Doctors is really based on the out-of-universe actors who played the character. On that basis, since the actor did not change, the numbering of the Doctor did not change either.






                share|improve this answer












                Personally, I also thought that by regenerating into the "same" body, that ought to count as two separate Doctors. However, regardless of in-universe status, the numbering of the Doctors is really based on the out-of-universe actors who played the character. On that basis, since the actor did not change, the numbering of the Doctor did not change either.







                share|improve this answer












                share|improve this answer



                share|improve this answer










                answered yesterday









                Buzz

                33.7k6114185




                33.7k6114185












                • Given the fuss Ten made about changing into a new body at the end (you know, about dying and a new man walking away with his memories) and how easily this went over, I conclude he didn't really regenerate here.
                  – Mr Lister
                  11 hours ago


















                • Given the fuss Ten made about changing into a new body at the end (you know, about dying and a new man walking away with his memories) and how easily this went over, I conclude he didn't really regenerate here.
                  – Mr Lister
                  11 hours ago
















                Given the fuss Ten made about changing into a new body at the end (you know, about dying and a new man walking away with his memories) and how easily this went over, I conclude he didn't really regenerate here.
                – Mr Lister
                11 hours ago




                Given the fuss Ten made about changing into a new body at the end (you know, about dying and a new man walking away with his memories) and how easily this went over, I conclude he didn't really regenerate here.
                – Mr Lister
                11 hours ago











                4














                The numbers generally refer to the number of times the Doctor has regenerated, distinct from the number of times the Doctor has consumed one of his available regenrations.



                In short, new face, new actor, new number.






                share|improve this answer


























                  4














                  The numbers generally refer to the number of times the Doctor has regenerated, distinct from the number of times the Doctor has consumed one of his available regenrations.



                  In short, new face, new actor, new number.






                  share|improve this answer
























                    4












                    4








                    4






                    The numbers generally refer to the number of times the Doctor has regenerated, distinct from the number of times the Doctor has consumed one of his available regenrations.



                    In short, new face, new actor, new number.






                    share|improve this answer












                    The numbers generally refer to the number of times the Doctor has regenerated, distinct from the number of times the Doctor has consumed one of his available regenrations.



                    In short, new face, new actor, new number.







                    share|improve this answer












                    share|improve this answer



                    share|improve this answer










                    answered yesterday









                    Stephen Collings

                    3,36022140




                    3,36022140























                        2














                        Canonically, there only is, was, and will ever be one Doctor. The numbering is simply a referencing device for commentating on the show.






                        share|improve this answer








                        New contributor




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                          2














                          Canonically, there only is, was, and will ever be one Doctor. The numbering is simply a referencing device for commentating on the show.






                          share|improve this answer








                          New contributor




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                            2












                            2








                            2






                            Canonically, there only is, was, and will ever be one Doctor. The numbering is simply a referencing device for commentating on the show.






                            share|improve this answer








                            New contributor




                            Clarius is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
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                            Canonically, there only is, was, and will ever be one Doctor. The numbering is simply a referencing device for commentating on the show.







                            share|improve this answer








                            New contributor




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                            share|improve this answer



                            share|improve this answer






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                            answered 12 hours ago









                            Clarius

                            211




                            211




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