What's the difference between the AA (ɑ) and AO (ɔ) sound?
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I'm working with the CMU pronunciation dictionary and I can't comfortably say I can understand what difference in sound they're trying to indicate by splitting AA and AO into different phonemes.
Wikipedia gives "balm" and "bot" as examples of the AA sound and "bought" as an example of the "AO" sound, but I don't detect a difference in vowel sound when i say the three words.
I also went through the CMU dictionary to look for examples of AA and AO words and still can't figure it out.
pronunciation ipa
asked Sep 9 at 2:55
Nathan Wailes
1013
add a comment |
up vote
0
down vote
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I'm working with the CMU pronunciation dictionary and I can't comfortably say I can understand what difference in sound they're trying to indicate by splitting AA and AO into different phonemes.
Wikipedia gives "balm" and "bot" as examples of the AA sound and "bought" as an example of the "AO" sound, but I don't detect a difference in vowel sound when i say the three words.
I also went through the CMU dictionary to look for examples of AA and AO words and still can't figure it out.
pronunciation ipa
asked Sep 9 at 2:55
Nathan Wailes
1013
4
Many American English speakers don't distinguish these sounds: this is called the "cot-caught merger". See nohat's answer to the question "Why are many TV personalities beginning to pronounce “daughter” as “dotter”?"
– sumelic
Sep 9 at 3:17
2
The CMU dictionary is presumably only meant to describe American English pronunciation. In British English "balm" and "bot" are as different as "chalk" and "cheese" - they couldn't possibly be described as two examples of the same sound.
– alephzero
Sep 9 at 9:46
1
Possible duplicate of Why are many TV personalities beginning to pronounce "daughter" as "dotter"?
– Nardog
Sep 10 at 0:19
@Nardog They are related questions but they are not the same question. I've already posted an answer to this question, and it would not serve as an answer to that other question.
– Nathan Wailes
Sep 10 at 0:45
@alephzero Not only that, "balm" and "bot" are different even in the parts of America without the cot-caught merger. I have no idea what Wikipedia is on about.
– Spencer
Dec 8 at 10:22
add a comment |
up vote
0
down vote
favorite
up vote
0
down vote
favorite
I'm working with the CMU pronunciation dictionary and I can't comfortably say I can understand what difference in sound they're trying to indicate by splitting AA and AO into different phonemes.
Wikipedia gives "balm" and "bot" as examples of the AA sound and "bought" as an example of the "AO" sound, but I don't detect a difference in vowel sound when i say the three words.
I also went through the CMU dictionary to look for examples of AA and AO words and still can't figure it out.
pronunciation ipa
asked Sep 9 at 2:55
Nathan Wailes
1013
I'm working with the CMU pronunciation dictionary and I can't comfortably say I can understand what difference in sound they're trying to indicate by splitting AA and AO into different phonemes.
Wikipedia gives "balm" and "bot" as examples of the AA sound and "bought" as an example of the "AO" sound, but I don't detect a difference in vowel sound when i say the three words.
I also went through the CMU dictionary to look for examples of AA and AO words and still can't figure it out.
pronunciation ipa
pronunciation ipa
asked Sep 9 at 2:55
Nathan Wailes
1013
asked Sep 9 at 2:55
Nathan Wailes
1013
asked Sep 9 at 2:55
Nathan Wailes
1013
asked Sep 9 at 2:55
Nathan Wailes
1013
asked Sep 9 at 2:55
Nathan Wailes
1013
1013
4
Many American English speakers don't distinguish these sounds: this is called the "cot-caught merger". See nohat's answer to the question "Why are many TV personalities beginning to pronounce “daughter” as “dotter”?"
– sumelic
Sep 9 at 3:17
2
The CMU dictionary is presumably only meant to describe American English pronunciation. In British English "balm" and "bot" are as different as "chalk" and "cheese" - they couldn't possibly be described as two examples of the same sound.
– alephzero
Sep 9 at 9:46
1
Possible duplicate of Why are many TV personalities beginning to pronounce "daughter" as "dotter"?
– Nardog
Sep 10 at 0:19
@Nardog They are related questions but they are not the same question. I've already posted an answer to this question, and it would not serve as an answer to that other question.
– Nathan Wailes
Sep 10 at 0:45
@alephzero Not only that, "balm" and "bot" are different even in the parts of America without the cot-caught merger. I have no idea what Wikipedia is on about.
– Spencer
Dec 8 at 10:22
add a comment |
4
Many American English speakers don't distinguish these sounds: this is called the "cot-caught merger". See nohat's answer to the question "Why are many TV personalities beginning to pronounce “daughter” as “dotter”?"
– sumelic
Sep 9 at 3:17
2
The CMU dictionary is presumably only meant to describe American English pronunciation. In British English "balm" and "bot" are as different as "chalk" and "cheese" - they couldn't possibly be described as two examples of the same sound.
– alephzero
Sep 9 at 9:46
1
Possible duplicate of Why are many TV personalities beginning to pronounce "daughter" as "dotter"?
– Nardog
Sep 10 at 0:19
@Nardog They are related questions but they are not the same question. I've already posted an answer to this question, and it would not serve as an answer to that other question.
– Nathan Wailes
Sep 10 at 0:45
@alephzero Not only that, "balm" and "bot" are different even in the parts of America without the cot-caught merger. I have no idea what Wikipedia is on about.
– Spencer
Dec 8 at 10:22
4
4
Many American English speakers don't distinguish these sounds: this is called the "cot-caught merger". See nohat's answer to the question "Why are many TV personalities beginning to pronounce “daughter” as “dotter”?"
– sumelic
Sep 9 at 3:17
Many American English speakers don't distinguish these sounds: this is called the "cot-caught merger". See nohat's answer to the question "Why are many TV personalities beginning to pronounce “daughter” as “dotter”?"
– sumelic
Sep 9 at 3:17
2
2
The CMU dictionary is presumably only meant to describe American English pronunciation. In British English "balm" and "bot" are as different as "chalk" and "cheese" - they couldn't possibly be described as two examples of the same sound.
– alephzero
Sep 9 at 9:46
The CMU dictionary is presumably only meant to describe American English pronunciation. In British English "balm" and "bot" are as different as "chalk" and "cheese" - they couldn't possibly be described as two examples of the same sound.
– alephzero
Sep 9 at 9:46
1
1
Possible duplicate of Why are many TV personalities beginning to pronounce "daughter" as "dotter"?
– Nardog
Sep 10 at 0:19
Possible duplicate of Why are many TV personalities beginning to pronounce "daughter" as "dotter"?
– Nardog
Sep 10 at 0:19
@Nardog They are related questions but they are not the same question. I've already posted an answer to this question, and it would not serve as an answer to that other question.
– Nathan Wailes
Sep 10 at 0:45
@Nardog They are related questions but they are not the same question. I've already posted an answer to this question, and it would not serve as an answer to that other question.
– Nathan Wailes
Sep 10 at 0:45
@alephzero Not only that, "balm" and "bot" are different even in the parts of America without the cot-caught merger. I have no idea what Wikipedia is on about.
– Spencer
Dec 8 at 10:22
@alephzero Not only that, "balm" and "bot" are different even in the parts of America without the cot-caught merger. I have no idea what Wikipedia is on about.
– Spencer
Dec 8 at 10:22
add a comment |
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Ok after continuing to go through the CMU dictionary I found some examples that made sense to me:
"AO" is the sound in "orange" and "port" where you bring your tongue and mouth in tighter than when you make the "AA" sound.
answered Sep 9 at 2:59
Nathan Wailes
1013
For many speakers, calm and father have different vowels.
– tchrist♦
Sep 9 at 14:25
@tchrist Really? Although phonetically they may differ somewhat, every dictionary I consulted, British or American, had /kɑːm/ as the most common (if not the only) variant.
– Nardog
Sep 10 at 9:22
1
@Nardog In some Midwestern American dialects, including the one I’m speaking to you in, the word calm starts just like Call me a taxi does. It’s like the vowel in all, and the L matters. You can call that L-colored if you want, but it’s really much closer to the CLOTH or THOUGHT vowel.
– tchrist♦
Sep 10 at 12:08
add a comment |
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Ok after continuing to go through the CMU dictionary I found some examples that made sense to me:
"AO" is the sound in "orange" and "port" where you bring your tongue and mouth in tighter than when you make the "AA" sound.
answered Sep 9 at 2:59
Nathan Wailes
1013
For many speakers, calm and father have different vowels.
– tchrist♦
Sep 9 at 14:25
@tchrist Really? Although phonetically they may differ somewhat, every dictionary I consulted, British or American, had /kɑːm/ as the most common (if not the only) variant.
– Nardog
Sep 10 at 9:22
1
@Nardog In some Midwestern American dialects, including the one I’m speaking to you in, the word calm starts just like Call me a taxi does. It’s like the vowel in all, and the L matters. You can call that L-colored if you want, but it’s really much closer to the CLOTH or THOUGHT vowel.
– tchrist♦
Sep 10 at 12:08
add a comment |
up vote
0
down vote
Ok after continuing to go through the CMU dictionary I found some examples that made sense to me:
"AO" is the sound in "orange" and "port" where you bring your tongue and mouth in tighter than when you make the "AA" sound.
answered Sep 9 at 2:59
Nathan Wailes
1013
For many speakers, calm and father have different vowels.
– tchrist♦
Sep 9 at 14:25
@tchrist Really? Although phonetically they may differ somewhat, every dictionary I consulted, British or American, had /kɑːm/ as the most common (if not the only) variant.
– Nardog
Sep 10 at 9:22
1
@Nardog In some Midwestern American dialects, including the one I’m speaking to you in, the word calm starts just like Call me a taxi does. It’s like the vowel in all, and the L matters. You can call that L-colored if you want, but it’s really much closer to the CLOTH or THOUGHT vowel.
– tchrist♦
Sep 10 at 12:08
add a comment |
up vote
0
down vote
up vote
0
down vote
Ok after continuing to go through the CMU dictionary I found some examples that made sense to me:
"AO" is the sound in "orange" and "port" where you bring your tongue and mouth in tighter than when you make the "AA" sound.
answered Sep 9 at 2:59
Nathan Wailes
1013
Ok after continuing to go through the CMU dictionary I found some examples that made sense to me:
"AO" is the sound in "orange" and "port" where you bring your tongue and mouth in tighter than when you make the "AA" sound.
answered Sep 9 at 2:59
Nathan Wailes
1013
answered Sep 9 at 2:59
Nathan Wailes
1013
answered Sep 9 at 2:59
Nathan Wailes
1013
answered Sep 9 at 2:59
Nathan Wailes
1013
1013
For many speakers, calm and father have different vowels.
– tchrist♦
Sep 9 at 14:25
@tchrist Really? Although phonetically they may differ somewhat, every dictionary I consulted, British or American, had /kɑːm/ as the most common (if not the only) variant.
– Nardog
Sep 10 at 9:22
1
@Nardog In some Midwestern American dialects, including the one I’m speaking to you in, the word calm starts just like Call me a taxi does. It’s like the vowel in all, and the L matters. You can call that L-colored if you want, but it’s really much closer to the CLOTH or THOUGHT vowel.
– tchrist♦
Sep 10 at 12:08
add a comment |
For many speakers, calm and father have different vowels.
– tchrist♦
Sep 9 at 14:25
@tchrist Really? Although phonetically they may differ somewhat, every dictionary I consulted, British or American, had /kɑːm/ as the most common (if not the only) variant.
– Nardog
Sep 10 at 9:22
1
@Nardog In some Midwestern American dialects, including the one I’m speaking to you in, the word calm starts just like Call me a taxi does. It’s like the vowel in all, and the L matters. You can call that L-colored if you want, but it’s really much closer to the CLOTH or THOUGHT vowel.
– tchrist♦
Sep 10 at 12:08
For many speakers, calm and father have different vowels.
– tchrist♦
Sep 9 at 14:25
For many speakers, calm and father have different vowels.
– tchrist♦
Sep 9 at 14:25
@tchrist Really? Although phonetically they may differ somewhat, every dictionary I consulted, British or American, had /kɑːm/ as the most common (if not the only) variant.
– Nardog
Sep 10 at 9:22
@tchrist Really? Although phonetically they may differ somewhat, every dictionary I consulted, British or American, had /kɑːm/ as the most common (if not the only) variant.
– Nardog
Sep 10 at 9:22
1
1
@Nardog In some Midwestern American dialects, including the one I’m speaking to you in, the word calm starts just like Call me a taxi does. It’s like the vowel in all, and the L matters. You can call that L-colored if you want, but it’s really much closer to the CLOTH or THOUGHT vowel.
– tchrist♦
Sep 10 at 12:08
@Nardog In some Midwestern American dialects, including the one I’m speaking to you in, the word calm starts just like Call me a taxi does. It’s like the vowel in all, and the L matters. You can call that L-colored if you want, but it’s really much closer to the CLOTH or THOUGHT vowel.
– tchrist♦
Sep 10 at 12:08
add a comment |
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4
Many American English speakers don't distinguish these sounds: this is called the "cot-caught merger". See nohat's answer to the question "Why are many TV personalities beginning to pronounce “daughter” as “dotter”?"
– sumelic
Sep 9 at 3:17
2
The CMU dictionary is presumably only meant to describe American English pronunciation. In British English "balm" and "bot" are as different as "chalk" and "cheese" - they couldn't possibly be described as two examples of the same sound.
– alephzero
Sep 9 at 9:46
1
Possible duplicate of Why are many TV personalities beginning to pronounce "daughter" as "dotter"?
– Nardog
Sep 10 at 0:19
@Nardog They are related questions but they are not the same question. I've already posted an answer to this question, and it would not serve as an answer to that other question.
– Nathan Wailes
Sep 10 at 0:45
@alephzero Not only that, "balm" and "bot" are different even in the parts of America without the cot-caught merger. I have no idea what Wikipedia is on about.
– Spencer
Dec 8 at 10:22